Republic Monotors
2 posters
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Republic Monotors
Some earlier two turret monitors
Milwaukee class Civil War river ironclad As Built: Displacement: 1,300 tons. Dimensions: 229 x 56 x 6 feet/69.8 x 17.07 x 1.83 meters. Propulsion: HNC steam engines, 7 boilers, 4 shafts, 9 knots. Crew: 120. Armor: Iron: 3 inch sides, .5 inch deck, 8 inch turrets. Armament: 2 dual turrets, each with 2x11 inch Dahlgren smoothbore. Due to report that image not showing post below here is the LINK.
Puritan Class post civil war seagoing monitor, As Built. Displacement 6,060 Tons, Dimensions, 296 x 60 x 18 feet/90.3 x 18.33 x 5.49 meters, Armament 2 dual 12/35, 6 single 4/40, 6 six-pound, Armor, 6-14" Belt, 14" barbettes, 8" Turrets, 10 " Conning Tower. Machinery, HC engines, 8 boilers, 2 shafts, 3,700 hp, Speed, 12 Knots, Crew 200 (270 wartime): Due to the report of image not showing, post below, here is the LINK.
Amphitrite Class Monitor: Displacement 3,990 Tons. Dimensions,262 x 55.5 x 14.5 feet/80.08 x 16.86 x 4.42 meters. Armament 2 dual 10/30, 2 6-pound, 2 3-pound. Armor, Steel & Iron: 9 inch belt, 11.5 inch barbettes, 7.5 inch turrets, 7.5 inch CT. Machinery, HC engines, 4 boilers, 2 shafts, 1,600 hp. Speed, 12 knots. Due to the report of image not showing, post below, here is the LINK.
Source of drawings Nav Source: LINK, look at monitor category for class names.
I imagine them more like the River Monitor the first drawing. Perhaps a tad more freeboard and more pointy bow and stern. There is a "flying bridge" between the turrets twin stack where the drawing shows three, note the stacks are across the beam not inline with the length. I would put four two meter [6' 6.6"] diameter Scotch Marine boilers in two boiler rooms flanking a central corador rather than the six riverboat style boilers shown. Note: no deckhouse between the turrets is noted. Deadly Shores page 427 in the Hardback has the following, "Greg noticed there were two columns of smoke above the twin turreted "Monitors" he had been told to expect, and the squat, ugly ships were steaming toward him." Straits of Hell Page 122 of the hardback notes Greg speaking with the Monitor's captain on the flying bridge."
Milwaukee class Civil War river ironclad As Built: Displacement: 1,300 tons. Dimensions: 229 x 56 x 6 feet/69.8 x 17.07 x 1.83 meters. Propulsion: HNC steam engines, 7 boilers, 4 shafts, 9 knots. Crew: 120. Armor: Iron: 3 inch sides, .5 inch deck, 8 inch turrets. Armament: 2 dual turrets, each with 2x11 inch Dahlgren smoothbore. Due to report that image not showing post below here is the LINK.
Puritan Class post civil war seagoing monitor, As Built. Displacement 6,060 Tons, Dimensions, 296 x 60 x 18 feet/90.3 x 18.33 x 5.49 meters, Armament 2 dual 12/35, 6 single 4/40, 6 six-pound, Armor, 6-14" Belt, 14" barbettes, 8" Turrets, 10 " Conning Tower. Machinery, HC engines, 8 boilers, 2 shafts, 3,700 hp, Speed, 12 Knots, Crew 200 (270 wartime): Due to the report of image not showing, post below, here is the LINK.
Amphitrite Class Monitor: Displacement 3,990 Tons. Dimensions,262 x 55.5 x 14.5 feet/80.08 x 16.86 x 4.42 meters. Armament 2 dual 10/30, 2 6-pound, 2 3-pound. Armor, Steel & Iron: 9 inch belt, 11.5 inch barbettes, 7.5 inch turrets, 7.5 inch CT. Machinery, HC engines, 4 boilers, 2 shafts, 1,600 hp. Speed, 12 knots. Due to the report of image not showing, post below, here is the LINK.
Source of drawings Nav Source: LINK, look at monitor category for class names.
I imagine them more like the River Monitor the first drawing. Perhaps a tad more freeboard and more pointy bow and stern. There is a "flying bridge" between the turrets twin stack where the drawing shows three, note the stacks are across the beam not inline with the length. I would put four two meter [6' 6.6"] diameter Scotch Marine boilers in two boiler rooms flanking a central corador rather than the six riverboat style boilers shown. Note: no deckhouse between the turrets is noted. Deadly Shores page 427 in the Hardback has the following, "Greg noticed there were two columns of smoke above the twin turreted "Monitors" he had been told to expect, and the squat, ugly ships were steaming toward him." Straits of Hell Page 122 of the hardback notes Greg speaking with the Monitor's captain on the flying bridge."
Last edited by Pokermind on Mon Dec 14, 2015 1:04 am; edited 3 times in total
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Something wrong with images - I couldn't see them.
Hm. The "Amphitrite" class, strictly speaking, aren't the early monitors. They are the so-called "refitted" civil war era "Miantonomoh"-class monitors. Actually, all this "refit" was the giant fraud to obtain money from Congress in 1870s; the supposedly "refitted" ships were, actually, scrapped (they were wooden and completely unfit for duty), and the new monitors were ordered under the same names.
Amphitrite Class Monitor: Displacement 3,990 Tons. Dimensions,262 x 55.5 x 14.5 feet/80.08 x 16.86 x 4.42 meters. Armament 2 dual 10/30, 2 6-pound, 2 3-pound. Armor, Steel & Iron: 9 inch belt, 11.5 inch barbettes, 7.5 inch turrets, 7.5 inch CT. Machinery, HC engines, 4 boilers, 2 shafts, 1,600 hp. Speed, 12 knots.
Hm. The "Amphitrite" class, strictly speaking, aren't the early monitors. They are the so-called "refitted" civil war era "Miantonomoh"-class monitors. Actually, all this "refit" was the giant fraud to obtain money from Congress in 1870s; the supposedly "refitted" ships were, actually, scrapped (they were wooden and completely unfit for duty), and the new monitors were ordered under the same names.
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
My opinion about the Republic monitors - is that they were close to the 1880s tech level:
Probably something like that:
The "Rusalka" (which generally mean something near the "Mermaid" - however, actually the Rusalka's aren't only sea sprites) class monitor of russian navy, build in late 1860s
Probably something like that:
The "Rusalka" (which generally mean something near the "Mermaid" - however, actually the Rusalka's aren't only sea sprites) class monitor of russian navy, build in late 1860s
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
Specifications of the Princeps Class Monitors: Edit
Here are the specs, based on general appearance of Amphitrite Class Monitor:
Displacement 2,150 Tons, Dimensions, 235 feet long, 50 feet beam, 8 feet draft, 4 feet freeboard, and crew of 110.
Armament as described four 8-inch (around 210 mm[1]) breech-loading, rifled cannons, mounted in two rotating turrets, with four Maxims.
Armor, 6 inches sides, extending 4 feet below waterline, 2 inches on deck, 6 inches protecting turret sides. Deemed sufficient at the time of construction to defeat 24pdr smoothbores--the largest guns the Doms were known to have at sea. Yes, they had observed them. [stuff on Republic & Dom contact I'm not allowed to share] Deckhouse is not armored.
Two boilers, two tall, thin stacks on centerline, single shaft, @1,000 hp. Speed, 8 Knots.
No fighting top, but mast is in about the same place as Amphitrite, with a higher crow's nest. Also, two (bare) yards for auxiliary sails and forestays for a jib. No aft sail capacity, obviously. Extensive flying bridge, with small protected pilothouse. Raised chain hawse. Screw is 2 bladed, and enclosed--NOT exposed shaft and rudder arrangement per USS Monitor. Note above from E-Mail from Taylor Anderson used with permission. MAY BE SUBJECT TO CHANGE!
For a good a drawing of the Amphitrite Class Monitors mentioned above see:
http://navsource.org/archives/01/monitors/amphitrite202.jpg
Here are the specs, based on general appearance of Amphitrite Class Monitor:
Displacement 2,150 Tons, Dimensions, 235 feet long, 50 feet beam, 8 feet draft, 4 feet freeboard, and crew of 110.
Armament as described four 8-inch (around 210 mm[1]) breech-loading, rifled cannons, mounted in two rotating turrets, with four Maxims.
Armor, 6 inches sides, extending 4 feet below waterline, 2 inches on deck, 6 inches protecting turret sides. Deemed sufficient at the time of construction to defeat 24pdr smoothbores--the largest guns the Doms were known to have at sea. Yes, they had observed them. [stuff on Republic & Dom contact I'm not allowed to share] Deckhouse is not armored.
Two boilers, two tall, thin stacks on centerline, single shaft, @1,000 hp. Speed, 8 Knots.
No fighting top, but mast is in about the same place as Amphitrite, with a higher crow's nest. Also, two (bare) yards for auxiliary sails and forestays for a jib. No aft sail capacity, obviously. Extensive flying bridge, with small protected pilothouse. Raised chain hawse. Screw is 2 bladed, and enclosed--NOT exposed shaft and rudder arrangement per USS Monitor. Note above from E-Mail from Taylor Anderson used with permission. MAY BE SUBJECT TO CHANGE!
For a good a drawing of the Amphitrite Class Monitors mentioned above see:
http://navsource.org/archives/01/monitors/amphitrite202.jpg
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
My drawing of a monitor so far:
You doing one Alexey?
Further along
You doing one Alexey?
Further along
Last edited by Pokermind on Thu Dec 17, 2015 4:01 am; edited 2 times in total
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
You doing one Alexey?
Yeah... but something about 8-feet draft is bothering me. Even the USS "Monitor" have more. Maybe 18-feet?
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
Eight foot draft is specified as is the four foot armor extension below waterline. I fudged making it two foot over the rudder & screw. a two and a half foot screw is to small for the horsepower, and four and a half foot marginal for a two blade screw. I won't get much done today, shopping and evening church service, gives me time to think about the powder and shell hoists thinking of putting them on the wall one for powder and one for shell hoist for each gun. That's the problem with us engineers we worry about the guts, that dictate the form. Thinking of raising the floor and putting two walk ways around a central magazine-turret room. That gray surrounding is the curve between the flat bottom and the straight sides up to the water linewhere it meets the tumblehome in two feet.
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Eight foot draft is specified as is the four foot armor extension below waterline.
Er... seems i couldn't understood you. How is this connected?
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
The hull line goes down straight four feet with 6" armor plate then two feet with say half inch plate that curves to meet the flat bottom. Over the screw and rudder I stole two feet to make a bigger screw and rudderthe flat bottom. leaving clear space for rudder and screw. I have not put in the lines yet to show the two foot stratight section that extends to where triangle at the rear of the engine room. Any sailors working on thesteering and the water tight seal on the rudder shaft will cuss this having to crawl in!
Pokermind- Posts : 199
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Re: Republic Monotors
And my attempt further along:
Last edited by Pokermind on Thu Dec 17, 2015 10:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
Pokermind- Posts : 199
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Re: Republic Monotors
It was a new image on DA see if this works better
http://pokermind.deviantart.com/art/Republic-of-Real-People-Principa-Class-578548617
http://pokermind.deviantart.com/art/Republic-of-Real-People-Principa-Class-578548617
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Latest version:
The upper most drawing is an over head view Rectangles are coaling hatches. To be done and the two boom cranes from the mast.
the next deck shows the interior of the turrets and the deck house from bow to stern has the enlisted men's head, the stairs to the lower deck then the crew's mess The galley. the blower room the officers quarters and the officer's head, wardroom then the stairs down to the engineering spaces. Two smaler drawings shoe the Forecastle and the pilot house.
The bottom deck roughed in notice raised passages around the Magazine Far forward is the chain locker next is the crew's berth, then the Magazine, then the Goat locker where petty officers are berthed, stairs up to Mess and forward crew's head. next are the port and starboard coal bunkers and the boiler room in the center, then the stairs passage way and paint locker, the rear Magazine surrounded by passages to the Engine room. Last is the engine room. In the Magazine the large red circle is where the hoistsfrom the turrets travel the inner circle ready shell storage.
The bottom drawing shows the starboard side notice ratlines and spars for sailing two square sails three jib sails, to be done ship's boats and the two boom cranes from the mast..
The upper most drawing is an over head view Rectangles are coaling hatches. To be done and the two boom cranes from the mast.
the next deck shows the interior of the turrets and the deck house from bow to stern has the enlisted men's head, the stairs to the lower deck then the crew's mess The galley. the blower room the officers quarters and the officer's head, wardroom then the stairs down to the engineering spaces. Two smaler drawings shoe the Forecastle and the pilot house.
The bottom deck roughed in notice raised passages around the Magazine Far forward is the chain locker next is the crew's berth, then the Magazine, then the Goat locker where petty officers are berthed, stairs up to Mess and forward crew's head. next are the port and starboard coal bunkers and the boiler room in the center, then the stairs passage way and paint locker, the rear Magazine surrounded by passages to the Engine room. Last is the engine room. In the Magazine the large red circle is where the hoistsfrom the turrets travel the inner circle ready shell storage.
The bottom drawing shows the starboard side notice ratlines and spars for sailing two square sails three jib sails, to be done ship's boats and the two boom cranes from the mast..
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Alexey I like how your drawing is progressing. Now for my latest did first cross section you can see the tumble home. May have to make boilers eight footers.
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Thanks!
The finalized design:
The “Princeps”-class monitor are in the water.
As on the US “New Navy” monitors, the deskhouse is octagonal, with conning tower near the bow part. On the roof of the conning tower the flying brige with two wings are placed. “Maxim” machineguns are placed at the corners of superstructure.
Two turrets are old-type cylindric turrets, with observation cone over each one. The embrasures are oval in shape. The semi-circles on deck are the indicators of the turrets train limits. Armed with old-type 8-inch muzzle breechloaders (prizmatic powder). No fire control.
Two indepedent boiler rooms, probably with some type of Scotch marine boilers, two compound engines working on the single shaft. All machinery arranged in central part, between turrets.
The ship is painted in traditional World War I German navy color scheme: underwater part – red-brown, near the waterline – dark-grey, abovewater hull – squirrel-grey, and turrets and superstructure are silver. The tops of smoke pipes, turrets and brige are black.
The finalized design:
The “Princeps”-class monitor are in the water.
As on the US “New Navy” monitors, the deskhouse is octagonal, with conning tower near the bow part. On the roof of the conning tower the flying brige with two wings are placed. “Maxim” machineguns are placed at the corners of superstructure.
Two turrets are old-type cylindric turrets, with observation cone over each one. The embrasures are oval in shape. The semi-circles on deck are the indicators of the turrets train limits. Armed with old-type 8-inch muzzle breechloaders (prizmatic powder). No fire control.
Two indepedent boiler rooms, probably with some type of Scotch marine boilers, two compound engines working on the single shaft. All machinery arranged in central part, between turrets.
The ship is painted in traditional World War I German navy color scheme: underwater part – red-brown, near the waterline – dark-grey, abovewater hull – squirrel-grey, and turrets and superstructure are silver. The tops of smoke pipes, turrets and brige are black.
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
Got the crew quarters, four tier bunks x 24 for crew gives 96 enlisted bunks 6 officer cabins 11 officers and the captain's cabin.
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Still, the engine placement is very... strange. Maybe better to move the rear turret close to the stern? So we could put the engine room near the boilers?
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
Dilandu "Still, the engine placement is very... strange. Maybe better to move the rear turret close to the stern? So we could put the engine room near the boilers?" And have the shaft running through the magazine and preventing the shell hoist and powder bag hoist from turning with the turret?
Size comparison Republic Monitor, USS Walker, Scott Class DD.
And the kinda finished drawing:
Size comparison Republic Monitor, USS Walker, Scott Class DD.
And the kinda finished drawing:
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Further work on the Turret
Turret design Hoists and turret motors are pneumatic telescoping pipe at bottom of hoist and2 cylinder 'steam engines' running on air that turn two of the eight wheels supporting the turret on the track: A third engine could be placed between the guns but without good access. These engines are placed here as most of the weight of the guns will be on those three forward wheels that the turret turns on. Exhaust from the engines and hoists will help blow smoke from the turret through the two gun openings. Compressed air can be supplied via a hollow pental with rubber washers or a stuffing box with a stationary ‘cup’ at the bottom or an electric compressor in the turret. Geared down electric motors could replace the ‘steam engines,’ however the pneumatic hoist similar to those seen in garages is the simplest mechanism to hoist the powder bags and shells. Likely a box of fusses will be in the turret so the shells only receive their fuse just prior to ramming. While a telescoping pneumatic ram could be installed on each gun more likely a wooden ram will be used.
Notice the wooden stand that allows the turret commander to see through the copula windows, and the ladder that allows the turret crew to enter.
Notice the wooden stand that allows the turret commander to see through the copula windows, and the ladder that allows the turret crew to enter.
Last edited by Pokermind on Mon Dec 28, 2015 6:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
Re: Republic Monotors
Can't see details... too little picture.
Dilandu- Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-07-23
Age : 35
Re: Republic Monotors
The only thing I can suggest is down load and enlarge on a drawing program this is a larger scale 1 pixel = 1" or 25mm. If you want I can send the drawing via an E-Mail if you PM the address you want it sent. The detail is quite visable on MS paint. Those members on the gun frame are equivalent to 4" or 100 mm H beams that cast frame is directly over a 4" by 5.5" (100 mm x 137.5 mm) I beam with half inch steel plate between. It should easily take the recoil. The trunion is 8" 200mm in diameter.
Pokermind- Posts : 199
Join date : 2015-07-02
Age : 70
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